Jim Scanlon (deceased)
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Post by Jim Scanlon (deceased) on May 7, 2013 11:33:54 GMT 9
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Post by Jim on May 8, 2013 1:38:22 GMT 9
From what I see, the "achiever" achieved after he got out of the AF............
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Jim Scanlon (deceased)
Senior Staff
FORUM CHAPLAIN
Commander South Texas outpost of the County Sligo Squadron
Currently: Offline
Posts: 5,075
Location:
Joined: July 2007
Retired: USAF
NBA: Spurs
NFL: Niners
MLB: Giants
NHL: Penguins
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Post by Jim Scanlon (deceased) on May 8, 2013 11:52:56 GMT 9
From what I see, the "achiever" achieved after he got out of the AF............
So, I think the main criteria is having been in the AF before you became famous, or did some "great" thing. 
Jim Too
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Post by LBer1568 on May 8, 2013 12:48:56 GMT 9
I was in the tenth year class at the USAF Senior Academy (1984 Jan-March). We started a tradition of leaving some "history" for future Enlisted Personnel. They had just added a AC-47 Gunship as a Static display in front of academy. Our class contributed, and made arrangements to add a full set of Guns for Gunship. We installed the guns after they were de-militarized. We had all of the existing Chief MSGT of AF in attendance during grad week. They came to several question/answer sessions as well as sitting in on classes. We also had John Levitow as a special guest for the full week as well. He was first enlisted MOH from Vietnam. He was gunner on AC-47 Gunship. So it all fit together.
Several of the CMSAF I had known prior to the academy so I got to speak with them
At one Joint Session, I asked the Chief's why we always ended up putting a bunch of Senior officers in Enlisted Shrines. I asked pointedly if they thought it was a form of A$$ Kissing. I voiced my opinion that we should be honoring Enlisted men and women instead of General Officers. It was funny seeing their reaction. The vast majority thought it was an Honor for the General's to allow us to enshrine them. I was a Chief Selectee during class, but due to slow promotions I had to wait until Oct 84 to pin on.
I said it then, and will say it again...Enlisted Achievers should be limited to Enlisted. And they should also be rewarded for actions on duty.
In our class we had the most decorated Active Duty person at the time. He was a SMSgt PJ and had the Silver Star, Air Force Cross, several Purple Hearts etc. he should have been one of the members of Achiever's Wall. We also had a B52 Gunner who survived a ejection of the Tail of his B-52 during Rolling Thunder. So I hope I am not the only one who feels this way about the Enlisted Achievers Wall.
Lorin
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Post by Jim on May 9, 2013 0:23:26 GMT 9
I was in the tenth year class at the USAF Senior Academy (1984 Jan-March). We started a tradition of leaving some "history" for future Enlisted Personnel. They had just added a AC-47 Gunship as a Static display in front of academy. Our class contributed, and made arrangements to add a full set of Guns for Gunship. We installed the guns after they were de-militarized. We had all of the existing Chief MSGT of AF in attendance during grad week. They came to several question/answer sessions as well as sitting in on classes. We also had John Levitow as a special guest for the full week as well. He was first enlisted MOH from Vietnam. He was gunner on AC-47 Gunship. So it all fit together. Several of the CMSAF I had known prior to the academy so I got to speak with them At one Joint Session, I asked the Chief's why we always ended up putting a bunch of Senior officers in Enlisted Shrines. I asked pointedly if they thought it was a form of A$$ Kissing. I voiced my opinion that we should be honoring Enlisted men and women instead of General Officers. It was funny seeing their reaction. The vast majority thought it was an Honor for the General's to allow us to enshrine them. I was a Chief Selectee during class, but due to slow promotions I had to wait until Oct 84 to pin on. I said it then, and will say it again...Enlisted Achievers should be limited to Enlisted. And they should also be rewarded for actions on duty. In our class we had the most decorated Active Duty person at the time. He was a SMSgt PJ and had the Silver Star, Air Force Cross, several Purple Hearts etc. he should have been one of the members of Achiever's Wall. We also had a B52 Gunner who survived a ejection of the Tail of his B-52 during Rolling Thunder. So I hope I am not the only one who feels this way about the Enlisted Achievers Wall. Lorin THANKS, Lorin, that is exactly how I feel. Johnny Cash was a drunk, a womanizer, convict and a hop head (Willy Nelson's mentor?) And all of this crap happened after he got out, so will some lunk head tell me how in hell the AF was an influence. As to officers being on there- more bullshit,_UNLESS HE HAD PRIOR ENLISTED TIME GET HIS NAME TO HELL OFF THERE...... And that SMSgt PJ should have been a charter member!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Every day more crap happens to piss me off. The Old Sarge |
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Post by LBer1568 on May 9, 2013 0:52:33 GMT 9
Amen Brother...
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Bullhunter
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Post by Bullhunter on May 9, 2013 1:46:07 GMT 9
Yes to what Jim said.
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Post by Jim on May 9, 2013 2:25:23 GMT 9
afehri.maxwell.af.mil/Researchpage/ResearchPageWorking.htmResearch revealed that on that "WALL" are 12 Generals, 13 Lt Gen, 28 Maj. Gen, 43 BGen and 1 Colonel.. Gen Chuck Yeager had a year as a flying Sgt., Maj. Gen Foulois was a 1st Sgt...General Creech never served enlisted. Maj Gen Charles Irions was the AF's youngest MSgt. Maj Gen Jeane Holmes was an E5 (pay purposes) while going through OCS. I see no enlisted career personnel listed by their rank. A large number of the generals served during WW2 as gunners, radio operator and aircraft mechanics (you know, guys from our world!!!).Although those going through OCS, OTS and those coming out of ROTC received the pay of an E-5 (SSgt), they were not "enlisted per se, they didn't wear SSgt chevrons! Nor did they act as NCOs... Some of those bios are interesting to read. But any who got paid as a SSgt while "learning" to be an officer, should not count as enlisted for purpose of being on the wall....... Glad I wasn't in the class with you, TDY would have been cut short no doubt!!!!!!!!!!!! The Old Sarge BTW The Army created almost 3,000 enlisted pilots from 1912 to 1942. Seven pre-War enlisted pilots and four World War 2 enlisted pilots became Air Force generals.[6] The USAF’s last enlisted pilot was Master Sergeant George H. Holmes (1898-?). Holmes had enlisted in the Army as a mechanic in 1919, became a pilot with the rank of corporal in 1921, and was promoted to lieutenant's rank in the Army Reserve in 1924. The Army later made Holmes an enlisted man and he served as both a mechanic and a pilot in the 1920s and 1930s. He was promoted to captain in 1942 and achieved the rank of lieutenant-colonel in 1946. He resigned his commission and reverted to his enlisted rank of master sergeant in 1946 and continued to fly until he retired in May, 1957.... GUESS THIS WASN'T MUCH OF AN ACHIEVEMENT when you compare him to generals..... I won't look at any more of the wall- it is a crock of crap.. Better to walk around the parade grounds at Lackland and look at the memorials to real enlisted-
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Jim Scanlon (deceased)
Senior Staff
FORUM CHAPLAIN
Commander South Texas outpost of the County Sligo Squadron
Currently: Offline
Posts: 5,075
Location:
Joined: July 2007
Retired: USAF
NBA: Spurs
NFL: Niners
MLB: Giants
NHL: Penguins
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Post by Jim Scanlon (deceased) on May 9, 2013 4:37:22 GMT 9
I may have left the impression, with my two posts on the Wall of Achievers, that I am in favour of it.
Far from it.
I thought it was interesting that a guy in NHRA made the "wall", along others who never made the Air Force a career.
I did put "achievers" in "quotation" marks, to make sure I was not misunderstood.
The real "Wall of Achievers" is in the Federal City.
It is polished black marble, with over 40,000 named engraved on it.
I agree with the statements about officers being on the "wall", they are, or very few, really enlisted.
Various and sundry "Enlisted Military Organizations", present awards each year to someone of "note".
Usually a general or congressperson.
Why, should The Order of the Sword go to a general, when there are enlisted who have done a lot more than any current general?
I think AFA probably does more to laud enlisted than any other group, but don't know for sure.
No, I am not a member, just read their on-line journal.
Maybe some of the thinking of "Hap" Arnold, who was the founder, is still there.
He knew how valuable the enlisted were to getting the job done.
He also started the Air Force Aid Society, which used to be almost exclusively to assist enlisted members in time of need.
Far too many officers look at those not officers as "enlisted swine", and only tolerate them.
When I was at Ubon, working Phase Dock, a pilot, major I think, came in to the phase shelter and climbed in to the F-4 sitting there.
He had a manual with him, so I suppose he was trying to get familiar with the F-4 cockpit.
After a while, he shouted "Hey, you".
The NCOIC of the crew was in the hanger, and the rest of us were out back, but looking and listening.
The NCO didn't move, but kept working on his paperwork.
Pretty soon, the officer yelled again.
He was more forceful this time, something to effect of "Hey, you, I am talking to you".
The NCO turned around from the desk, looked at the officer and said: "Are you talking to me?".
The officer, who seemed to be getting upset, let loose with an explative-filled comment, that meant yes.
The NCO, very calmly, turned toward the officer and began:
He pointed to his TSgt chevrons and said: "This is my first name."
Then he pointed to his name tag and said: "This is my last name."
He then walked out of the hanger.
The pilot climbed down from the cockpit and headed for the maintenance office.
The chief of maintenance, from what we were told, reamed him a new one, and I never saw him again.
I suppose he became a general.
Oh, Well!
Jim Too
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Post by pat perry on May 10, 2013 2:11:46 GMT 9
A word for Fast Jack Beckman... He's a good guy - the kind you'd like to spend talking airplanes and drag racing with over a few adult beverages. Jack has a BLOG on the NHRA web site and here is his latest entry about the rain out in Atlanta last weekend and has some words on the Enlisted Heritage Hall. www.nhra.com/blog/beckman/2013/05/09/it-never-rains-in-california-but-it-does-everywhere-else/Excerpt from blog posting: Atlanta was by no means a complete bust. Wednesday night Coca-Cola hosted all current and former NHRA champions to a dinner at their headquarters. Thursday I made the three hour drive out to Montgomery (as in, Alabama) to Maxwell-Gunter Air Force Base. There resides the Enlisted Heritage Hall, which houses a museum as well as the Enlisted Wall of Achievers. I’m pretty sure you can Google it if I’ve totally confused you. My former fellow airman (and still friend) MSgt. Bruce Stansel submitted me for this honor, and I really didn’t know what to expect.
When we arrived for the induction on Thursday, I couldn’t believe that there were only 143 individuals pictured on the wall. I guess I just imagined there’d be thousands of them. The ceremony was really cool, with several Colonels and officers as well as lots of high ranking enlisted personnel. What a thrill to have my picture mounted on the same wall as Charlton Heston, Johnny Cash, and George Bush. My pic is right next to Chuck Yeager, two over from Carroll Shelby, and just above Peter Graves (“Mission Impossible”). Damn…that’s good company!
As soon as my mug got mounted on the wall, it was time to change into a suit and tie (for the second time in two days…I packed stuff into the race transporter back in Vegas so I didn’t wrinkle my clothes in a suitcase) and boogie up to Talladega. The International Motorsports Hall of Fame was inducting Don Schumacher, just the 11th drag racer to be given the honor. There were more than 60 DSR folks there to support our boss, and it made for a special evening.
Jack was Fuel Funny Car World Champ last year and holds ET and MPH records at the moment. He's one of the best fuel drivers in NHRA and admits that when he went into the USAF it was the best thing that ever happened to him thanks to the discipline and respect he learned from his NCOs. This young man is a winner. Pat P. |
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Post by Jim on May 8, 2016 4:49:53 GMT 9
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Post by Gene on May 13, 2016 22:28:52 GMT 9
www.wingsacrossamerica.us/wasp/ www.wingsacrossamerica.org/above---beyond.html Boeing on Call for Air Force One Replacement Design —WILL SKOWRONSKI Air Force Materiel Command intends to award a sole-source contract to Boeing for preliminary design activities on the Air Force One replacement aircraft, according to a request for proposal released May 10. If finalized, the deal would modify a January contract that awarded the manufacturer $25.8 million to begin work on risk reduction activities for the Presidential Aircraft Recapitalization program. The RFP notes the scope of the work would include two presidential transports. A service spokesman told Air Force Magazine in an email the quantity is based on the approved acquisition strategy and President Obama's Fiscal 2017 budget submission. Prior RFPs noted the service was looking to buy up to three aircraft. Final decisions on the number of aircraft that will make up the fleet and their capability requirements are expected to be made this summer, when the program is scheduled to reach Milestone B. If approved, the aircraft will be bought, and preliminary design will begin. The service bought the 747-200Bs—military designation VC-25A—that make up the current presidential fleet in 1987; the first was put to use as Air Force One in September 1990. Article source: www.airforcemag.com/DRArchive/Pages/2016/May%202016/May%2013%202016/Boeing-on-Call-for-Air-Force-One-Replacement-Design.aspx
Pat P.
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Post by Gene on May 13, 2016 22:32:22 GMT 9
www.wingsacrossamerica.us/wasp/ www.wingsacrossamerica.org/above---beyond.html WASP Bill Passes Congress —JENNIFER HLAD A bill to allow Women Airforce Service Pilots, or WASPs, to be inurned at Arlington National Cemetery has been approved by Congress and is awaiting a signature from President Obama. The legislation, championed by Air Force veteran Rep. Martha McSally (R-Ariz.), makes WASPs eligible for military honors and inurnments at Arlington; the women had been eligible for those honors from 2002 until March of 2015, when then-Secretary of the Army John McHugh reversed the original decision. WASPs were the first women trained to fly American military aircraft. They flew airplanes, trained combat pilots, and towed airborne targets. Though 38 WASPs died in service, the women were not granted veteran status until 1977. "It's been just 19 weeks since the Army's decision to kick out our pioneering female World War II pilots was brought to light, and we've been fighting ever since," McSally said in a written release. "I'm proud to see [the legislation] clear Congress and encourage President Obama to sign it immediately." The Air Force Association supported the legislation and celebrates its passage, AFA President Larry Spencer said. "The Women Airforce Service Pilots are World War II heroes. We encourage the President to support this legislation by signing the Congress-backed bill immediately," Spencer said. The final version of the bill was passed by the Senate on May 10 and was unanimously approved by the House on May 11. Article Source: www.airforcemag.com/DRArchive/Pages/2016/May%202016/May%2013%202016/WASP-Bill-Passes-Congress.aspx
Pat P.
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