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Post by dude on Mar 8, 2010 11:47:53 GMT 9
I saw a Su come through Lakenheath late 98 that had thrust vectoring. May have been a prototype, I don't know. My point is, they have the technology also. Now, just so I understand, ALL american fighters prior to the F-22 were developed, upfront, for export? The SR-71, U-2, and F-117 excluded. If I'm wrong let me know. I'd like to know of an airframe we didn't export.  Don't know of any Russian production plane that had it. But agee vectoring is the small end of the technology stick. My point was not all aircraft are developed upfront for export and you cite 3 examples. I believe other examples would include the F-15E and any of the family of Wild Weasels. On the Navy side I don't think anyone else has F-14s or F-18s(?); certainly not FA-18s. No one else has EA6-Bs either. Other examples are bombers, but we don't need to go there. Exportable fighters should be those platforms like the F-35 that involve joint investments by foreign concerns for its upfront development. The F-22 sale is probably moot anyway. Too much opposition in Congress and uncertainty about how cost effectively it can be done. Is there a point downstream when it would be ok to sell the F-22 abroad? Sure the day after its replacement is fielded. But by then the LM production line would be long cold and USAF would be selling out of existing inventory. |
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Jim Scanlon (deceased)
Senior Staff 
FORUM CHAPLAIN
Commander South Texas outpost of the County Sligo Squadron
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MLB: Giants
NHL: Penguins
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Post by Jim Scanlon (deceased) on Mar 8, 2010 13:01:14 GMT 9
In the early Nineteen Hundreds, Wilbur and Orville Wright tried to sell their Wright Flyer A models to our military. They were not interested.
So, Wilbur and Orville put the plane on a ship and went to Europe. They demonstrated and sold airplanes in Europe.
That has been happening ever since.
The P-51 was originally a contract from England for a fighter to augment the RAF planes in service. It was a dog at altitude. Had an Allison 1710 CI engine without a supercharger. The Brits used it for ground attack. Then the US decided to get involved and put a Rolls-Royce Merlin, 1650 CI and a blower, in the machine and history was made.
The Soviet Union probably flew more P-39s than anyone else.
Australia and Spain fly F/A-18s. Iran, yes Iran, fly F-14s, if there are any in commission.
Israel has probably done the most with our newer fighters. They modify them to meet their needs, and in many cases make them better than the originals.
The F-111 is still in use in Australia, although they may retire it this year.
The A-37, F-4 and F-5, are still being flown by lots of countries, both friendly to us and not so friendly.
I think we will continue to see lots of US designed airplanes being sold to other countries.
Jim Too
:god_bless_usa
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soc
F-106 Skilled
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Post by soc on Mar 8, 2010 18:34:34 GMT 9
Finland, Switzerland, Kuwait, and Malaysia all fly the F/A-18, and Malaysia has even been offered the F/A-18F.
The production Su-30MKI sold to India, Malaysia, and Algeria does have thrust vectoring, and the new Russian Su-35 does as well. The Sukhoi that would've been seen in '98 with TVC was the Su-37 demonstrator. Interestingly, they dorked around with the FCS, put stock engines back into it, and were able to replicate the TVC's maneuverability. Goes to show just how well the aircraft was designed aerodynamically.
The T-50 is interesting, it appears designed for low RCS in the front quarter, drawing an enemy into a WVR fight where it looks to have some serious maneuvering capability.
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cc790
F-106 Skilled
F-106 '80-'84 F-15 '84-'01
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Post by cc790 on Mar 8, 2010 21:48:53 GMT 9
I saw a Su come through Lakenheath late 98 that had thrust vectoring. May have been a prototype, I don't know. My point is, they have the technology also. Now, just so I understand, ALL american fighters prior to the F-22 were developed, upfront, for export? The SR-71, U-2, and F-117 excluded. If I'm wrong let me know. I'd like to know of an airframe we didn't export. Don't know of any Russian production plane that had it. But agee vectoring is the small end of the technology stick. My point was not all aircraft are developed upfront for export and you cite 3 examples. I believe other examples would include the F-15E and any of the family of Wild Weasels. On the Navy side I don't think anyone else has F-14s or F-18s(?); certainly not FA-18s. No one else has EA6-Bs either. Other examples are bombers, but we don't need to go there. Exportable fighters should be those platforms like the F-35 that involve joint investments by foreign concerns for its upfront development. The F-22 sale is probably moot anyway. Too much opposition in Congress and uncertainty about how cost effectively it can be done. Is there a point downstream when it would be ok to sell the F-22 abroad? Sure the day after its replacement is fielded. But by then the LM production line would be long cold and USAF would be selling out of existing inventory. The F-14 was due to export to Iran in the 70's. The F-15 E is called the F-15I in Isreal. The Wild Weasel is not a specific airframe. Modified for specific missions. The same with the EA-6. |
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Post by Jim on Mar 9, 2010 0:40:51 GMT 9
I saw a Su come through Lakenheath late 98 that had thrust vectoring. May have been a prototype, I don't know. My point is, they have the technology also. Now, just so I understand, ALL american fighters prior to the F-22 were developed, upfront, for export? The SR-71, U-2, and F-117 excluded. If I'm wrong let me know. I'd like to know of an airframe we didn't export. A/C that were built for USAF/Marines and not for export, but were later exported F-80, F-86, F-94, F-100 to name some........ Yes all of these ended up in foreign hands, but not designated for export from the start........ BTW, The F-5 A,C, and E were all originally intended for export........, But this all of this was before your time.......... The Old Sarge |
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Post by dude on Mar 9, 2010 1:21:25 GMT 9
OK I give up. Maybe I'd feel better about it if we had about 350 of them instead of barely enough for about 10 decent squadrons. 
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Post by steve201 (deceased) on Mar 9, 2010 5:27:45 GMT 9
I saw a Su come through Lakenheath late 98 that had thrust vectoring. May have been a prototype, I don't know. My point is, they have the technology also. Now, just so I understand, ALL american fighters prior to the F-22 were developed, upfront, for export? The SR-71, U-2, and F-117 excluded. If I'm wrong let me know. I'd like to know of an airframe we didn't export. Don't know of any Russian production plane that had it. But agee vectoring is the small end of the technology stick. My point was not all aircraft are developed upfront for export and you cite 3 examples. I believe other examples would include the F-15E and any of the family of Wild Weasels. On the Navy side I don't think anyone else has F-14s or F-18s(?); certainly not FA-18s. No one else has EA6-Bs either. Other examples are bombers, but we don't need to go there. Exportable fighters should be those platforms like the F-35 that involve joint investments by foreign concerns for its upfront development. The F-22 sale is probably moot anyway. Too much opposition in Congress and uncertainty about how cost effectively it can be done. Is there a point downstream when it would be ok to sell the F-22 abroad? Sure the day after its replacement is fielded. But by then the LM production line would be long cold and USAF would be selling out of existing inventory. wrong-o kemosabe....the F14 was exported to Iran ..when the sha fell..they kept the F14a's but couldn't get any parts for them..thus they were grounded..... the F18 is exported to canada/australia/swiss/etc.... the F15E is being exported to korea/japan/taiwan/ etc..... everything is up for grabs here.... Steve |
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Post by steve201 (deceased) on Mar 9, 2010 5:31:14 GMT 9
guess I shoulda kept reading cuz they were all answered.....someday I'll learn to finish reading ....
Steve
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Don't know of any Russian production plane that had it. But agee vectoring is the small end of the technology stick. 
